Category: News and Views
I heard on my local news today that parents want to ban hairy podder materials from school libraries. I disagree with this. I know that they want to ban them because of witchcraft and so on but it's all fiction and I say if the kids want to read the books then for goodness sake let them read them! What do you all think?
Troy
i say, who gives a damn! If they're smart kids, they'll eventually get ahold of the material anyways.
Oh, more hysteria over the Potter books. So the mere fact that witchcraft exists in the books will get them banned without even trying to discover if the spells actually work or not? I would think witchcraft could only be a threat to somebody if it really truly worked, couldn't it? I'll bet ya dollars to doughnuts that none of these parents sat down and read the books either. They just heard from some friend or authority figure that the books had witchcraft or mention of it in there and the parents went all crazy with hysteria.
these people are morons. enough said!!
I think the parents need to find better things to do. So what, it's witchcraft! I mean, what's going to happen? One of the characters is gonna leap out of the book and start teaching the kid witchcraft? lol, morons. I don't see the problem.
agree with voldimort on this one
Lol Kala. Probably. It's ridiculous. Sorry. Aren't there enough books about witches for little children? In Germany there is a series of books and tapes about a little girl that is a witch. So what? What#s their problem?
lol, pretty much agree with what's all ready been said, they must think like hitler
Zentar that's an ignorant crass and stuipd thing to say. Let the children decide after all if you condemn something children immediately want it, so the school are shooting themselves in the foot. Over here there is an american trying to ban HP as she is convinced that the books encourage an interest in withchraft, where is her evidence...
But wouldn't a lot of parents argue that kids aren't experienced enough in life to make their own decisions? I mean, I agree that kids should make up their own minds, but a lot of parents, especially those with, let's say, very strongly-held beliefs of a sort, want total control over the info that goes into the minds of their kids because they fear the outside world and society so much and see it all as nothing but bad?
well if harry is going, then so are all the other fantasy novels ever written too. can't have one can't have none. hary potter won't go anywere, it's jsut a few over exagerating parents, and the media making it even mroe over the top than it already is. ignore it, it always goes away.
The Harry Potter series aren't the only books that talk about magic and witchcraft. If kids want to read those books, then they'll find a way to whether they're banned or not. Seriously, some people are so stupid.
I agree totally, Maria.
That's what our world is coming to!
When these parents are gone, who will fight to keep the minds of children free from things associated with darkness?
I suppose these parents fear that the books can serve as a channel into more serious problems. Just as gangster rap was a huge influence to the trend of gang violence in the late 80's early 90's, just as celebrities influence trends in young teens such as starving themselves to look a certain way, so too will these books influence the children in some way or another.
I agree that these books should be banned from schools.
Morons! Seriously people!
It's just a book, and it's not the music that influenced the kids, they can make their own decisions.
I really hope these books don't get banned because if anything they are a good read, no one had complaints when they wrote the hobbits, or narnia, or any other fantasy books out there. Why all of a sudden, Potter?
I believe these things do influence not only children but adult as well. How do you think hippies spread from one country to another? Why so much gang violence after gangster rap debuted? Why? Why? Why?
If you're not a parent, then of course you won't know what it means to want to protect a child.
Is it better to let the kids listen to aggressive music? These books are not totally aggressive. Some music is, and video games. There are, seriously, other things to care about, more important ones than these books.
As I said before there are so much worse things being written, being done, and yet you care about something as fictitious as a harry potter book? *sighs*, what this world is coming too.
In the late 80's early 90's the FBI investigated satanic ritual abuse among teenagers. They found that most of what was being said was untrue. That is, these teens weren't criminals as so many made them out to be. It was discovered however, that some were involved in animal torture, sexual misconduct, and other things. Many believed that this trend was caused by heavy metal music.
I think people react to growing trends that appear to hold humna beings under their sway. Just think back to that song by the Kinsman, I think it was them, titled Louie, Louie. There was an FBI investigation to see what made that song so popular. They looked to find if there were subliminal messages being sent through the music. I don't think there was, but this shows us that people react to such things because of the control people seem to be under.
If you were never influenced by gangster rap or heavy metal, that shouldn't give you the right to say that nobody can be influenced by such music. Not everyone is the same. And I just think parents fear their children will be caught in the web as some other children have been.
yes, not everyone is exactly the same, some are brought in by witchcraft and violence. Some aren't. thanks for making our point for us, we owe you one...let me wave my magic wand and see if anything happens...nope...
Something did happen, I'm laughing at what I've posted on this subject. Thanks!
Raskolnikov, you're so dumb... its. just. a. fucking. book. There's a lot worse shit out there and if I'm ever a parent, my kids will be able to read the books if they want to. Honestly...
This kind of sensorship is closed minded and dangerous and must not be allowed. If you start with fiction, then it could very well move on to other things.
All I was trying to point out was that these parents have the right to protect their children if they think this book is harmful. I think the presence of such persons is necessary in this world, a world moving more and more toward immorality. They're the ones who keep this world's sanity in balance. I won't ever depreciate their voice because their cause, as unpopular as it may be, is in my opinion an honorable one. So you just keep going along with whatever everyone else is saying, and I'll stay over here with the dummies.
It's a matter of principal. Let's get Sibreena the teen age witch taken off tv, and let's ban haloween. Hmm. and while we're at it right wingers, you all could say that the crucible should not be read in school, and that Bram Stoker's writings should be banned. How far would it go? I mean look. If you look at nursery rhymes and other accepted children's stories, although many have been extremely censored and altered over the years, many of those are awful in what they depict. Read the original brother's grimm for example, which is an accepted book for children, or was for a very long time at least. This is so ludacris.
Exactly. As I already said: It is all a bit exagerating. Almost in every book there is something happenning. And as you already said: That Sabrina series - what's wrong with it? What's wrong if little children play witches and wizards. They can't do no harm. It's ridiculous.
But all this will become irrelevant when Pat Robertson will become Supreme Reverend General in 2008. There will be no Harry Potter to poison the minds and souls of America's youth or adults. There will be no video games, no more Hellivision, save for the teachings of our Supreme Reverend General, no books but the Bible, no movies, no cartoons, no music, not even gangster rap, and of course, no dancing. No sex, save for if it is approved by General Robertson himself. No alcohol, cigarettes or drugs, and in fact, very little mindless pleasure of any kind, unless it is a reward for great self-sacrifice or very hard work. Life will be just what it should be. No more chaos, immorality, evil, or the biggest, baddest, scariest thing of all, change. Yes, we will be bored silly, but we will most certainly be moral and oh so safe, whether we like it or not. . Oh, and having a sense of humor will be outlawed as well. LOL!
I only agree with what puggle has to say, that it will go away. That's what happens to anything that is good, it's always silenced. There's no point in fighting it! Poor parents, their noble efforts in vain. That's what the world is coming to! If these parents don't speak out against what contradicts their beliefs, who will set the principles for their children? It's thrown away , and the ones responsible are raking in all the money. Damned vultures!
principles? i think these people are do gooder morons, nothing more or less. if i really want witchcraft all you need to do is to type pagan or other such things into google and i can dig up things far worce and far more invoking than what the harry potter books can offer. and lol lets also be honest and say that a child doesn't have to do more than type magic into a search engine, so ok lets ban the internet as well, then i wouldn't have o listen to mindnummingly boring shit like this and what's more wouldn't have the need to feel the need to respond to t either. come on grow up!!
I used to know a guy who was obsessed with such books. He also had collections of horror movies, heavy metal and punk rock music, novels by Maupassant and other authors who write about ficticious characters who murder, rape, steal, etc, and he was so under the sway of these things, these ideas and philosophies creeping in such material that nothing in his room had anything to do with love (that is, if it wasn't a twisted kind), peace (that is, if it had nothing to do with satisfaction that's derived from revenge); let me just tell you, he was completely twisted inside and his reading, listening, and viewing preferences reflected that abnormality. There are many such persons in the world, who have no desire for sunny things, for loving things, for normal things. You walk into their lives, their rooms are dark, their thoughts are dark, their humor is dark, everything about them is dark. Can you honestly tell me that you'd see nothing wrong with such a person, a person who gets no joy out of the happier things of life?
I'm not saying that people who read Harry Potter fit this description, but I'm just trying to explain what parents are trying to protect their children from becoming. It's a natural impulse for parents to protect their kids, and I guess that when they see the whole world falling under the sway of a series of books that deal with witchcraft, they're going to be alarmed as any intelligent person would be.
It has a lot to do with how the subject of witchcraft was once viewed. These days it seems as though there's nothing holding back influences that were once considered unproductive. Some cultural pundits would say that the US is drifting away from its religious foundations, and that this is an example of where morality is headed.
I think that as long as there are people to remind us of where we once were and to where we've come, the world is a better place because of them. But still, I don't think they'll ever beat the sway of what they're fighting against, only a balance is what they're efforts will achieve. And that, to me, is worth the effort!
I think the booksare fine i mean shit someone started this shit in st. louis and they got no where. Instead of hp being banned if i remember correctly the child was given an alternate assignment and the bible banned which is what should have happened
The bible banned? That's even more absurd.
I agree that a parent has a right, I guess if you can call it that, to protect their own children. I think, however, that banning books from public or school libraries is a bit of a drastic measure if your goal is to protect just one child or one set of children. Or do these parents feel they have some, here we go again, right to protect everybody's kids whether the other parents agree with the protection or not? And how do these parents know that said protection will guarantee the kids will turn out the way the parents wish? I just hope there's no backlash when the kids grow up, start going to therapy, and blame their overprotecteive parents for all that's wrong with them. Plus, at what time was the world, and I guess you mean the entire planet, ever moral? Only way you will get everyone to be moral, and I mean everyone, is illustrated in my satirical but scary post above. So do you want a cChristian theocracy Borg collective or a politically-correct Borg collective? Boy, Atlas, I hope you have strong shoulders, taking on the whole planet like that and wanting to fix it all? Good luck in your quest.
Amen, godzilla.
I couldn't have said it better myself. If the parents wanna protect their children, fine, do it. But that does not mean take away other children's joys and fantasies, banning books from schools in my oppinion is not the way to go.
I have to agree with the most recent several posts. If a parent wants to restrict their child from reading certain material, or listening to certain music, or whatever, that is their right. However, there comes a time when the child must start deciding on their own what is apropriate for them, and the parents must cut the cord as it were. This is a normal part of any child's development. I do think though that these parents who are really restrictive about things, must have forgotten what it was like to be a child or a teenager. At that age, it's normal for a kid to want to rebell, and if they have all these restrictions on them, those will be the first things they do.
Finally, I want to say that I don't have children, so don't know first hand what raising a child is like. However, I'd like to think that if I objected to something my child was doing, I would make sure to experience it myself before passing judgement. I dare say that the people objecting to the HP books have never actually read them, since you never see them cite specific examples of what is wrong with the books.
jesus h christ!! It's just a book! I can't believe that these stupid parents don't have anything better to do then attack a purely fantastic series. I was just watching Opra today, I know laugh if you want, grin, but they were showing footage taken by a journalist who managed to get into north koria. Every thing that people see on tv and read and see is about their government and their great leader. There's no free thinking. It's all controled by the government. I thank god everyday that I live in a society where I can choose what I read and watch and listen to. And I can't believe that these parents want to promote sensorship and control what people read. If they want to ban something as anoculous as Harry Potter, they should just move to NOrth Koria.
I guess what I was trying to point out is that I value the opinion of such persons because if it weren't for people like them, not even the simplest warning would exist to make a child, adolescent or adult second guess what they do and why they do it. Just imagine if there were no warnings of a sharp curb up ahead on the road, no warnings of a steep hill up ahead. In the same way, if not even the slightest warning or word of caution exists to cause a person to second guess what they are doing, there will be nothing to hold back that person; he or she will get swept away and be overcome by anything.
I remember when I was a teenager and going to junior high, my friends and I used to pass by a popular place called the stoner's hole, where students would ditch, smoke weed, and hang out. It was a concrete tunnel that served as part of the sewage system in that city. It ran for about four miles underneath the freeway and the western part of that city. We had to bend down to walk in it. We had been in it several times, but then we chose to stop going there because we once took a flashlight and went about three miles inward. As we drifted farther inside, the hole became square and the walls became taller. We flashed the light on the walls and began to notice a lot of vandalism that dealt with witchcraft; pentagrams, drawings of naked women having sex with pigs, backward crosses and some prayers to the devil. My friends and I saw that and just got the heck out of there. To be honest, the only thing that kept me from going any farther down that hole was my mom's voice coming to mind, telling me that witchcraft is a bad thing. I moved out of that city around eleven years ago, and just four years ago I learned from some of my friends that a woman's body had been found at the end of that tunnel. I wish I had the news article to post it here. It was discovered that a group of hobos lived there, that was their home. They entered that sewage system through another manhole, though. I knew these men; I'd see them begging, drinking, smoking, and just loitering outside of stores. But I never knew what they were into. I'm not going to argue that these men did what they did to that woman because they were devil worshippers; men do evil things for many reasons. But just imagine what would have happened if I had never been warned by my mom that witchcraft is a bad thing.
The same thing can happen to kids these days if there is no one to appeal to their conscience. If I had never been told that witchcraft is a bad thing, I would have looked at those drawings on the walls and would not have seen the danger. If kids these days aren't warned about anything, especially about things that have a reputation associated with evil as does witchcraft, then what's to stop them from moving on to taking witchcraft more seriously, what's to stop them from becoming wiccans or witches or satanists? Everyone is saying that witchcraft is harmless, that persons who practice it are harmless, but I know firsthand that that just isn't true. I'm not going to hide the truth from my kids, and I'm not going to live n denial either just to go along with the crowd. I believe that to tell children, to present to children something as serious as witchcraft in a harmless way is a deception. Presenting witchcraft in a playful or fictitious fashion to kids who can't even comprehend the truth of its nature comes very close to brainwashing. So that's why I praise these parents for what they attempted to do. Hopefully, other parents will be more careful and educate their kids about what they're getting into and about what the world tells them. Only this way will they learn to not go along with the trends or the crowds, and to think for themselves.
I don't know what issues you have or why you keep wanting to involve christians or the bible in this discussion when that has nothing to do with it.
First of all, like most folks, you're confusing witchcraft with devil worship, as in human or animal sacrifice. There are even some belief systems that call themselves Satanism but ahve nothing to do with the classic devil figure or any human or animal sacrifice. Google can be a wonderful thing if you're curious to know more about waht I'm saying here. Second, it's Christians who get picked on because, at least some of them are a very vocal minority who seem to spend a good amount of time publicly going on about how evil or potentially evil just about any aspect of secular society is unless it has their particular pet beliefs as an integral part of it. I don't hate Christians, as many of them are nice, level-headed, thinking people. But it's the fanatics who get the most press and airtime and end up ruining their image for us, the unsaved masses. These fanatics make Christians look like a bunch of stodgy stuck-in-the-mud folks who want to spoil everybody's fun.
Witchcraft or satanism, it's all the same mumbo jumbo to me. I don't need to look any further into these things to understand that a person completely under the influence of such ideas or beliefs as the ones these systems propose is going in the wrong direction. I can walk down town and see businesses offering to read palms or cards, and yeah, it may seem harmless and silly to some, but to me it's all tied in with pagan beliefs of invoking deities for some personal benefit. Casting spells, invoking deities whose authorities are over the forces of nature to do harm to others, reading palms or cards, astrology, inquiring of mediators between the physical and the spiritual, believing nature is a god, to me this all falls under the same category: paganism. I'm not a superstitious person, but I'm well aware of the abuse that goes on in the world. It's all part of the money-making machine.
But the battle is long lost. No use in fighting it!
I don't know about you, but I grew up with the teaching that if it looks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, then it's a duck. I'm not going to fall for that so-called washing down of serious things: I'd rather call the thing what it really is; if it's evil, then it's evil, if it's dark, then it's dark, if it's bad, then it's bad. I'm not gonna say it's a little bad or it's not that bad, or it's harmless or it's childsplay. That sort of reasoning has served to convince millions to try drugs, have sex and make unwanted babies or catch std's or aids, and so many other things that have been entered into because of ignorance or just plain brainwashing. And that's exactly what's going to happen with some of these kids. Do you think the authors of Harry Potter give a rat's ass about these kids? They just want their money! Who's to say some of these kids won't ever fall for the lure of witchcraft? They've already been desensitized to it. And the fact that people confuse witchcraft with devil-worship doesn't make witchcraft less harmful or harmless. In my reasoning, that only makes witchcraft guilty by association., too similar in nature to distinguish itself. Any resistance to witchcraft that their parents can nurture is priceless, as it will perhaps steer them away from those things.
There is a good reason for why people react negatively to witchcraft, it's an idea that is incapable of being divorced from evil. White magic, blue magic, yellow magic, checkered magic, satanism, whatever you wanna call it, all that mumbo jumbo involves the same idea.
These intelligent parents responded to their responsibility as parents, and I commend them for it. It's sad though that not that many take to heart what's going on all around the world. We've all become crippled by and desensitized to a certain degree to immorality, the damned money-making machine. Let it blot out any remaining glimmer of thought, let it cast its spell on us. I mean, everyone is taking the malevolence out of evil, the wickedness out of wicked, the darkness out of dark, the shamefulness out of shameful; going so far as to call evil good, call hatred cool, call pornography funny,. I can't tell if it was the Renaissance or the twentieth century that started this off. But, in the end, I guess I have to admit, this is all a part of life and has always been; the influence of Hollywood, the slavery, the bewitching of our minds for a lifetime, "a penny for your thoughts" (or mind,), give me, give me, give me your money, and so on and so forth, forever...I wonder what filled the role of Hollywood in the old days.
And by no means do I count myself above this or immune to rottenness, I am rotten to the core, not only because of the influence of the world but also because that's just the way I came. I'm not gonna hide behind ambiguities, not when the truth has already been thrown out of the door.
And, no, this has nothing to do with religion, christianity, the bible, parents' vain appeals, or anything else that brings us back to our senses. I'm just talking about the truth, reality god damn it!
Ok, a friend just told me about this topic and I am going to chime in with my views on this subject.
Right off, I am going to state that banning the books is ludicrous.
The reason they give is because it is Witchcraft. Well, then lets ban Snow White, sleeping beauty, hansel and grettel, beauty and the beast, Pinocchio, Cinderella along with a load of other children's books. After all, they too, all have witchcraft and magic as a part of the storyline.
In the original snowwhite, the wicked queen *who had magic* tried to kill snowwhite 3 times. In Disney's version as well as the books, she sent a henchman to kill her and bring back her heart. I guess one could say that is sending the wrong message, therefore we shouldn't allow kids to see it.
In hansel and grettel, the witch was going to cook them, so lets scrap that. Sleeping beauty, the evil witch cast an evil spell to make sleeping beauty touch a spinning wheel and die. *That goes out the window as well*
Here is one I forgot to mention, the wizard of Oz. Now there is a definite use of magic. Lets take all those stories and burn them, not allow our kids to read them. It will corrupt their minds, they will go out and murder because they see them. They will go, grab kids, and cook them in an oven, cut out their heart and any other thing because they have read them.
If you are going to ban them, then lets also not allow our kids to learn about history. You want to talk about brutality? What about Hitler? What about back in the Roman times, or when the Puritans were burning innocent people. That is ok to learn, but a fiction novel is not?
Also, since any form of paganism is evil, then we better rethink Christmas as well as Easter. Most of what we view as Christian symbols have pagan roots. We celebrate Christmas in December. The celebration was set for that time to discourage unbelievers from their winter solstice festival. So Christmas, while it celebrates our savior’s birth shares the pagan day of feasting. Yule logs are pagan as well. Even the word Easter, is from an old Celtic pagan word. It is from the goddess of spring. I can't remember how to spell her name, it is something like Eeresta, but she was the goddess of new life. Eggs were hidden and found and the rabbit was Eresta's symbol because they were so prolific. We should ban that too, since it is of pagan origin.
Harry potter, is make belief, fiction. And, it is the parents who make the big deal out of it. Children know it isn't real, it is a story, make believe, pretend. Lets tell our kids that they can't have an imagination anymore, while we are at it. I am saddened for parents who must have forgotten what it is like, being a child.
Do you know what all these stories have in common? Both the fairytales I talked about above and Harry potter? They discuss good verses evil and you know what? They show too, that good triumphs over evil. In the end, goodness prevails, not evil.
I am a Christian, but I have a problem with some Christians who feel that anyone who believes differently then they, are evil, or heathens. That is a very narrow minded and judgmental way of thinking.
Someone said that they went into a place where they saw pentagrams and disturbing images written on a wall. I agree with you in that it was sick and twisted and wrong. However, to state flat out that it is witchcraft is wrong.
There are forms of witchcraft that teach nothing of that. Wickens, for instance, *which you lumped in as evil* preach peace and to harm none. That is their main rule. They do not KILL, SACRIFICE or harm anyone. Nor, do they wish harm on another.
Are there some beliefs that do such things? Absolutely. But, to say that all who practice a form of witchcraft are evil and do this, is unjust.
I have read all the Harry Potter books and I don't see the problem with them. I don't see where J. K. Rowling says that it is good to kill or anything. I see good verses evil and that good struggles to combat evil, but will come out victorious. How is that so different from real life?
As for someone going out and committing a heinous crime simply because they read it, saw it on TV or heard it in a song, that is nothing more then an excuse. To often, in our society, people try to place blame everywhere except where it belongs. It is always someone else's fault, music, TV, books. It can't be the one who did it? A song made him shoot someone, it is McDonalds fault a woman held a cup of coffee between her legs and spilled it, burning herself. Never is it the individuals fault, it is unfair to place the blame on the person who did the action.
I doubt, that the book, or movie made them go out and kill. A sick person may get an idea from things they hear. The ... desire to kill, *or whatever you want to call it. I don't understand how anyone could want to* but, the desire to kill, was already inside of them. What they saw didn't suddenly implant the need in them; they already had problems to begin with.
How often have you heard of a person who killed someone and it was a shock to all. They lived a normal life, not dark, not twisted and yet they killed. Why? Since it is outside influences that make someone do as they do, why would a person who didn't have any of these characteristics do such a terrible thing. Why, for example, did that man in Pennsylvania kill those poor girls in the Amish school? It was a shock to everyone. He seemed completely stable, and yet he did as he did.
I, along with most of society, can see something on TV, or in a book and not go out and do it simply because of that. To add to this, a person doesn't have to be raised as a Christian to know right from wrong. As long as a child is taught what is good and not, they can differentiate between good and bad.
Parents have the right to keep their child from reading Harry Potter but they don't have the right to impose their beliefs on the rest of the world. They are entitled to feel Harry Potter is evil *though, personally I think they are over reacting* But, to take it out of a school library simply because of the voice of a few, is ridiculous. Who are they, to decide for everyone else's children.
What exactly is in the books that are going to harm the growth of a child? What evil things are written on the pages? Or, is it simply because there is magic, therefore it is inherently evil.
This country was founded on the basis of free speech, freedom of expression and freedom to believe as desired. Yes, a parent has the right to not allow their children to be exposed to literature like that. But, everyone else has as much right to read it if, they are comfortable with it. And no one else has the right to take that away. What happened to majority rules?
If the parents who had objections were told that they had to read Harry Potter to their children or else their children would get a failing grade, then I would understand their complaints, but this isn't the case. They have a choice, and shouldn't take anyone else's choices away.
I believe wearing fur coats is wrong. So, do I have toe right to go to a neighbor who is wearing a fur coat and saying, I think that is wrong. I feel it is cruel. Therefore, since I don't like it, you aren't allowed to wear a fur coat. Or, perhaps I should go to the local center for the blind here, which often works with a fur coat company to raise money. I should tell them that since I think it is cruel and wrong that they can't sell them because it bothers me. I don't have that right, and neither does anyone else.
There isn't sex, drugs, or obscenities in the books so what is the problem? Obscenities are the only thing not protected by the first amendment.
I am going to end this by saying; I respect everyone's opinion, even if I disagree with some. I just wanted to throw out my views on this issue.
take care
Raskolnikov,
can I ask how is it all mombo jombo?
There is a clear difference between good and bad witchcraft. Yo said why do people view it with such negativity if it weren't evil? Easy because they have the same narrow minded view.
As I said in my previous post, there are such things and evil witchcraft. Bad people who worship witchcraft. But, you know what? there are bad people in all walks of life. You don't group everyone together.
things are not that black and white.
Their are some who view Americans as evil and need to be anialated. They view us in a negative way, so because they do, does that mean they are right?
sure, there are bad americans but to lump everyone together is unfair.
As I said, I do not follow witchcraft, but it is a belief, just as Christianity, Muslem or Judaism is.
NOt all are. Some simply claim it as a belief to attempt to give them license to do disgusting things and they have issues. But, Wickens and pagans believe in a higher being who created all just as I, as a Christian do.
You can't lump things together simply to fit yoru deffinition when it isn't founded in truth. as you say, some are exactly that, sick, evil horrible immoral people, but not all who practice it are.
Many are not. I hear more crimes and things being done by people who weren't around witchcraft then I do people who were.
I have to say one more thing for the night.
Raskolnikov,
I don't know if you take any medicine now or have in the past, but if so you are wrong then for doing so. Medicine is a drug and since drugs are all bad, they are bad too. At least, according to your logic. Since there isn't a shade of gray in things, it is either one way or another, then all drugs are bad, including medication. Heart pills, diabetes medication, it is all bad because there are other drugs out there that can hurt you, and are not good for you.
Does it matter that they help, not harm? no, it is irrelevant because they all must be grouped together as one and judged accordingly.
This is not my belief at all. I am simply trying to illistrate why things aren't all blakc and white. Things can't be all this way or all that way.
There are terrible drugs, that mess you up, aren't healthy at all. Cocaine and weed, *I know some thing it is fine. I don't want to even enter into that discussion, please* along with many others. But with the logic that something either is one way or the other this is what it comes down too.
If that form of thinking is ok with witchcraft then why not with drugs as well. Or anything in the world for that matter.
First of all, I think your comment "There are some who view Americans as evil and need to be annihilated" is a bit too extreme. People can judge Americans any way they want, we do this same thing to muslims and Koreans, but to say that we need to be annihilated for judging them as evil is a bit too extreme for me. Ha ha ha! I'm just playing with ya.
I always do my best to avoid extremes, and I thought I had presented a well balanced argument in my earlier posts. But now it seems like I've been misunderstood because you think I'm against every kind of entertainment, drug, belief, etc. Now you're going to extremes to make a point, and I must admit that you make a good point, but I was never against what you've said.
Not once did I say that witchcraft is evil, I said it's so commonly confused with and so closely related to satanism that it's impossible to tell them apart. Satanism, witchcraft, astrology, reading palms, etc, all these in my opinion fall under one category, and that is paganism. The fact that witchcraft and satanism are so commonly confused should send a message to those thinking of getting involved. Why the heck would anyone want to identify with witchcraft when it's so closely related (regardless if it's mistakenly related) to satanism? And even if some adherents to witchcraft don't profess belief in satanism, why do they still have a reputation for being involved in some type of evil? You would think that this alone would dissuade anybody from becoming involved with such things but on the contrary these things are passionately defended just to serve as some form of entertainment.
If witchcraft is so harmless, then why isn't it presented in accordance with what the adherents believe? Why don't they just come out and simply say the truth about witchcraft to the kids? Why must they do it in a way that downplays or distorts the truth, why use deception? What are they trying to hide if it's so harmless? I have no problem with kids learning about history, but when facts are clouded, when ideas or words are taken out of context, when certain things are left out, when the truth is deliberately manipulated, then that causes me to become alarmed.
Why don't the parents of kids who can't live without Harry Potter encourage them to become witches? Why aren't there classes at preschools and elementary schools teaching kids how to do magic? It's harmless, right? Why aren't parents sending their kids off to, I don't know, "Witch Whitecloud's" class to learn how to do magic or cast spells? Maybe that's a good sign for the harry Potter fans, something clearly is keeping them from taking this step. Thank your god for that!
You don't need to keep pointing out the obvious, that doesn't serve any purpose here. Of course there is no difference between the themes in children's books, don't you think I'm aware of that? And please don't accuse me of being narrow minded or of going to extremes because I always try my best to avoid slandering what I myself don't fully understand.
The huge difference that I see, though, and that many people seem to be in denial of, is the way things are presented to kids, things which are in their truest nature, how can I say this, out of the ordinary. If you're gonna try to steer your kids away from drugs, are you gonna tell them some washed down version of what drugs can do to a person's brain, life, or family? No! You ought to tell them all about it without wresting any idea here or there, then let them decide if that's something they want for themselves. That's what books such as these can do to some of these kids, they make witchcraft appear harmless to the point that, if some of these kids ever come to consider becoming involved in it, will see witchcraft with the misconception the book Harry potter fashioned in their minds, and they will not see the true face of witchcraft.
I don't even think parents know what witchcraft truly teaches. All I know about it, and I confess that my perspective of it might be shot through with many holes, is that it has always been associated to some extent with satanism or with things out of the ordinary. And just because I don't know everything that there is to know about a particular subject, in this case witchcraft, that doesn't mean I'm gonna conclude that it's not good for anybody. But if I'm a parent, and I see my child getting involved with something reputedly evil, if I see my child getting involved with something I myself as a parent do not fully understand, then I'm gonna restrict my child from it, at least until I educate myself about it more thoroughly.
And, Pebbles, if you want to go to extremes, then tell me why you've made the assumption that the parents who want these books out of the library are exaggerating. Don't you see that you're making the assumption that the parents who deem these books acceptable know beyond a doubt that these books are harmless? I'll bet you a million bucks that not even these parents know what the true face of witchcraft is. In that case, the parents who are restricting their children from these books are behaving in a much wiser fashion than the parents who claim these books are harmless but who in reality know nothing at all about the subject of witchcraft. Let these parents first educate themselves about the subject of witchcraft to the point where they can make an educated decision, until then, you can just set aside that notion of majority rules, because in my opinion, wisdom should rule at all times. I think that these parents you defend are simply going along with the crowd, everybody's doing it, so it can't be that bad. I commend the parents who speak out against witchcraft, even if it's something they don't fully understand, not taking at face value what the author of Harry Potter has to say about her/his own book; of course he or she is gonna flatter the crowd with words, with the purpose of making her/his merchandise look acceptable for all, little kids, too. Give her/him your money, he'll give you the grandest stories. That damned bastard author her/himself probably doesn't even know what the truth about witchcraft is! But the whole world seems to be under his spell...
I agree with your view about people using the excuse: the devil made me do it. But I also think that not all cases are the same, at times the environment, influences or experiences, can drive a man insane or to do things he wouldn't normally do; everyone has a breaking point, and not everyone is sensitive in the same areas.
Stupid! There is witchcraft in the HP series, but it's not like the spells actually work!
"There is witchcraft in the HP series, but it's not like the spells actually work." Yup, more evidence of brainwashing; so sad, so terribly sad... You see, you guys, I rest my case.
So are you saying that the spells in the HP books actually do work? If so, sign me up.
The spell is getting stronger you guys, you see? Another victim of witchcraft. I've been saying it all along, please, whatever you do, watch yourselves! Break free from it now, now before it's too late! The author of Harry Potter is out to get us all...Oh no!
me too. And I agree with pebbles on all of her posts
Listen up carefully you guys: Everything I've been saying on this topic has turned out to be true. Don't believe me? Check out Chymera's post: Is Harry Potter Really that Good? There you will find the naked truth, the stinking, awful, in-your-face truth. Read about your fellow zoners who admit to having a problem with the spells the author of Harry Potter is casting upon the reading world at large. It's time for you to take back your minds, take back your lives. Take my hand; I'll help you overcome this bedazzlement. Hurry,hurry while there's still time. Don't be a victim any longer to the money-making machine!